[Torg] Hi all

[Kansas Jim]

Phil writes:

> --- Benjamin Grant <benn at 4efix.com> wrote:

>> The fact of the matter is, that TORG is (IMO) the 
>> premier RPG system to run any cinematic game in at all!  
> 
> I used to agree with this, but from extensive playing with my
> group I changed my mind. For my group, Torg just had too much
> crunch. One or two players in particular struggled with the
> range of decision making available to them... well, I say
> struggled, what I really mean is they just took bloody ages to
> balance the various tactical options, approved actions, cards
> and p-points! 

I don't usually see players' options as part of the crunch of
a system. Now if after they decide what they're going to do it
takes them a couple more minutes to count up all of the modifiers,
that's crunchy!

> I also ultimately found that while the level of detail involved
> in the Values & Measures was mathematically beautiful, it just
> wasn't needed for my style of cinematic game. 

That, yes, is crunch that most cinematic RPGs these days have
done away with. Over on the WEG forums someone noted recently
that he's never used the limit values in his Torg games because
that amount of detail about how fast someone moves has never been
necessary in his games.  People have complained for over a decade
about the number of charts in the game. And of course there's
the perennial favorite, the spell design system....

> If I was to play Torg again, I think I'd tweak a rules-lite
> version that eliminates a lot of the detail but retains some
> card play (which I think is one of the really innovative and
> cinematic mechanics). Or use Savage Worlds, which strikes me as
> a nice looking rules-lite cinematic game.

SW's designer is an admitted fan of Torg and I can see some
Torgian influences in parts of it. I haven't had much luck with
it though, game play has never seemed quite as heroic/cinematic as
it claims to be ("Fast! Furious! Fun!"). But I only have the first
edition of the rules, maybe the current edition has dealt with
the problems I encountered.

-- 
Kansas Jim, Torg guru (ksjim (at) sdc (dot) org)
Torg website: http://www.sdc.org/~ksjim/index.html