[Torg] More General Initiative Thoughts

[Benjamin Grant]

I need to correct my post as it turns out: I listed four aspects that any
Initiative System should probably cover: Order, Interruptive Actions,
Holding Actions, and Improving Initiative.  I left out the fifth, equally
important question:  Aborting or Changing one's actions or target(s).

 

I would at this point rewrite those final paragraphs to better read:

 

So, one needs some method for determining the answers to several timings
based matters.  I think they broadly break down to three basic timing
concerns:

*	Order: Who's actions get resolved first?  This is obviously the most
important question regarding timing.
*	Interruptive Actions: In what ways can one interrupt an action?
That is, if one character starts an action, is there some way in which under
the right circumstances another character can start and complete an action
before the resolution of the action of the first character?
*	Holding Actions: Can one simply "hold" one's action, and choose to
go later in the round?  If so, how does that affect the timing of the
resolution of that character's actions?  Also, can one perform an actions
almost to completion and hold there, like holding a weapon on someone?
*	Improving Initiative:  Are there methods or mechanics for influence
the timing itself, to directly influence one's order of resolution of
action?  Such as some kind of "refocus" mechanism by which a character can
instead of acting seek out more favorable timing for one or more future
rounds?  Perhaps there are ways to act sooner or more quickly?
*	Aborts and Change-ups: And finally, how does the timing change when
you abort your action, decide to target a different foe, or decided to do
another action entirely?

The answers to these five concerns define and delineate the Initiative
System of any game.  So when reviewing or creating an Initiative system, the
factors to closely examine are Order, Interrupts, Holding, Improving, and
Change-Ups.



Hope you don't mind, but you mentioned you were going to save them, so I
thought I had better make the correction. J

 

-Benn Grant

 

From: torg-bounces at justintimeadventures.com
[mailto:torg-bounces at justintimeadventures.com] On Behalf Of winstoninabox
Sent: Thursday, June 19, 2008 6:43 PM
To: torg at justintimeadventures.com
Subject: RE: [Torg] More General Initiative Thoughts

 

I think your posts about Initiative (and the timing of actions) have been
fascinating reading, and I"m saving them to my file of interesting stuff
about TORG.

Game mechanics aside, the posts highlight timing effects that GMs of any
game should keep in mind when in play.

Thanks.

winston

  _____  

Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2008 13:06:58 -0400
From: benn at 4efix.com
To: torg at justintimeadventures.com; jeff at chaosphere.com
CC: 
Subject: [Torg] More General Initiative Thoughts

More General Initiative Thoughts in prep for round two. 

I thought it would be useful for me to take a step back and devote one post
to the basics of initiative in RPGs, to clearly (and hopefully correctly)
state the point of all of these systems.  What I am about to go into maybe
be obvious and completely un-earthshaking, but I feel that at least I could
benefit from the examination. 

There are generally three kinds of pace to storytelling:

*	There's the standard pace when you looping through asking each
character what they are doing, and reporting back to them their successes
and failures, along with any new circumstances that arise.  This is the time
I think that most game are in most of the time.
*	There's the slower pace often referred to as "macro" time when the
player and the GM discuss what is happening in very general terms, typically
for long endeavors like travelling or less interesting parts of the story.
*	Then there the action sequences where a lot of attention is paid to
details, timing, and other "micro" matters.  This can be called "going into
Combat", although that can be inaccurate if the action conflict is non
physical in nature.  A more accurate term, which is also widely used, is
"round-by-round", called that for obvious reasons

It is in this third pacing of roleplaying that timing matters become
important.  If two characters are reaching for the crystal, who gets it
first?  If one character tries to attack a helpless victim, can another
character interrupt that action?  If one character hangs back, to better
react to unfolding events, does this prevent him from reacting in time?  If
a character starts to do an action, but changes their mind halfway through
to do something else instead, does their new action resolve before or after
other actions do?  And so on.

In many cases, there can be round-by-round action without the order of
action being contested.  For example, if three characters are working
together to disarm a bomb, they can go in any order they wish.  It is
usually only in inter-character conflict and/or competition that the order
matters.  Therefor, it is quite appropriate no matter what initiative system
one favors or uses, to ignore it until it is needed - but when it is needed,
one pulls up the numbers and mechanics and determines the timings.

And let's be even more clear here:  We are not as concerned with the order
in which characters *begin* their action (although that can be important
too) but the order in which the actions actually *resolve* and *happen*.  So
when we are talking about who gets to go first, we are really talking about
who's actions get resolved first, not begun first.

[Side Note: Some actions have effects that do not take place until later,
even though the action finishes earlier.  For example, the action of a
character might be to hit the button that releases the sleep gas in the test
chamber.  The action actually has three points of timing: when the action
begins, when it completes, and when it's effects happen.  In this case, the
character starts to the action by telling the GM she is pushing the button.
The action resolves when she actually pushes the button.  The *effect*
resolves when the sleep gas gets released and begin to force the inhabitants
of the test chamber to make Toughness checks.

Most *action* resolution is simultaneous with effect resolution - pulling
the trigger of a gun resolves the action of "I fire at Brad" and determining
what if any damage Brad suffers resolves the effect of that action, and both
usually happen simultaneously in RPGs.  While actions that have delayed
effects like the sleep gas example above need to be carefully overseen and
timed by the GM, the majority of timing concerns will be related to the
resolution of the *action*, with the *effect's* resolution being
simultaneous and concomitant. ]

So, one needs some method for determining the answers to several timings
based matters.  I think they broadly break down to three basic timing
concerns:

*	Order: Who's actions get resolved first?  This is obviously the most
important question regarding timing.
*	Interruptive Actions: In what ways can one interrupt an action?
That is, if one character starts an action, is there some way in which under
the right circumstances another character can start and complete an action
before the resolution of the action of the first character?
*	Holding Actions: Can one simply "hold" one's action, and choose to
go later in the round?  If so, how does that affect the timing of the
resolution of that character's actions?
*	Improving Initiative:  And finally, are there methods or mechanics
for influence the timing itself, to directly influence one's order of
resolution of action?  Such as some kind of "refocus" mechanism by which a
character can instead of acting seek out more favorable timing for one or
more future rounds?

The answers to these four concerns define and delineate the Initiative
System of any game.  So when reviewing or creating an Initiative system, the
factors to closely examine are Order, Interrupts, Holding, and Improving.

My question to the list in general is does this sound accurate in defining
and describing the general needs, goals, and designs of RPG initiative
systems overall?  

-Benn

 

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