[TORG] Why don't wizards run around in tin cans?

Tue Aug 4 14:35:27 EDT 2009

Let me clear up an assumption, most likely triggered by my
dramatization of the question. I am not talking about what a magician
can *buy* versus what he can *cast*. But consider this. A warrior will
strive to wear the most protective armor out there, and if magic can
help increase that, and he can afford the magical enhancement, so much
the better.

Why don't wizards operate on that same assumption? Why do we not see
standard wizards, both in Torg and in traditional fantasy, clamoring
for the hard crunchy shell that keeps the soft chewy center from being
Purina Dragon Chow?

This problem doesn't exist in certain systems. Depending on the
version, Dungeons & Dragons either prohibits wizards from wearing the
tin can, imposes a penalty on spellcasting, or requires investing in
feats to make it happen, so the answer in those systems is either a
flat "they can't" or "it's gonna cost you". Rolemaster takes the
second approach, first by creating a mechanic called Extraordinary
Spell Failure, then creating an expensive skill called Transcend Armor
that reduces the effect of ESF.

Is there such a tradeoff in Torg other than that of obtaining the
trades to purchase the tougher armor or claiming it off a fallen foe?
Should there be?

Dominick Riesland, aka Rabbitball
Creator of the Cosmversal Grimoire
"There are always possibilities, my sergeant told me. But he never had
his possibilities torn away like wings from a fly."

On Tue, Aug 4, 2009 at 8:01 AM, Cedric Chausson<deathwindfr at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hey,
>
> IMVHO, another thing not to forget is that not all mages have access
> to all spells. That is the reason why spell books are so valuable. The
> gamer's perspective where you get to choose your spells at creation is
> skewed for commodities sake, you usually give the player the spell
> book and let him decide which spells he wants and he chooses according
> to his skillss and spell adds (and often players choose their skills
> and spells adds according to the spells they want!). They are few
> things that you can do to avoid this. This is why during the character
> creation process, I always asked players to choosse their skills
> first, with only a short description of the kind of spells they could
> be used for and then after I gave them the spell book. Of course, this
> is not 100% perfect especially with older player who know the
> different spells but it tends to lessen the optimization factor.
>
> Also in the general world, things are not so simple and NPCs mages do
> not have access to all spells as they are costly and the mage that
> taught you does not have acces to all spells. If spells were as easily
> accessible like things you download on the net you would maybe have a
> lot of persons running around in tin cans but the fact is not everyone
> far from it has access to Armor of the Draconis Metallica.
>
> This is all the more so that do not forget that the spell
> characteristics in Pixaud's are supposed to be the stats for the best
> of the best. You are supposed to downgrade the characteristics of the
> spell to get the more commonly known versions. So for most of mages
> the protection from the spell might be not as good as the pure version
> or the spell might be so hard to launch that only a few can manage it.
>
> Just my two cents and all of this IMVHO,
>
> Cedric the Heretic,
>
>
>
> 2009/8/4 Samuel Phillips Koller <spkoller at uwm.edu>:
>> *in a thick Russian accent*  One word..TRADITION!!!
>>
>> Ok but seriously, why would they?  It makes no logical sense for them to do so, presuming that game mechanical math reflects physics or magical principles they are aware of.
>> The average caster will have sunk as many points as possible into Perception and Mind, with Spirit as a close third (disconnect = BAD) so they are likely to have about 10 in toughness, if that.  SO if they are wearing the best you can get at early game (plate mail) then they are going to end up with an armor value of 16.
>>
>> Now come the math.  Light armor has an effect = toughness of 16, the same as plate mail.  A few simple manipulations (cast=> duration, Diff=> backlash, Backlash => effect) and our mage might well end up with a armor toughness in the 20's.
>>
>> Enchanted plate mail you say.  Well obviously, but lets have a look here.  Presuming are mage is reasonably competent, he could very well manipulate the effect value up to 30.  30-25=5 so the power push table says that our plate mail now has a value of +8/27.
>>
>> But let us say instead our mage decided to run out of the house in his underware.  A few rounds of manipulation later (most of them dealing with cast time and duration) our magical underpants (silk lining) are +6/25, almost as good as the plate mail, and certainly less expansive!
>>
>> just my 2 cents
>>
>> S Koller
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Dominick Riesland" <rabbitball at gmail.com>
>> To: torg at justintimeadventures.com
>> Sent: Tuesday, August 4, 2009 12:11:58 AM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
>> Subject: [TORG] Why don't wizards run around in tin cans?
>>
>> As far as I have examined the rules, there is nothing preventing a
>> wizard from running around in Armor of the Draconis Metallica (or
>> other similarly tough metallic covering for their otherwise soft,
>> fleshy bodies), and yet they never do. Why is that?
>>
>> Dominick Riesland, aka Rabbitball
>> Creator of the Cosmversal Grimoire
>> "There are always possibilities, my sergeant told me. But he never had
>> his possibilities torn away like wings from a fly."
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