[Torg] Fortune and the Future (was: The Magic Axiom Chart)

[Phil Dack]

----- Original Message ----
> From: Jones Jasyn <jasynj at gmail.com>
> To: torg at justintimeadventures.com
> Sent: Mon, 1 February, 2010 17:51:30
> Subject: [Torg] Fortune and the Future (was: The Magic Axiom Chart)
> 
> On Feb 1, 2010, at 9:59 AM, Phil Dack wrote:
> 
> >> From: Jones Jasyn 
> 
> >>> Low Axiom magic is intriguing. How do you think different axioms affect the 
> >> 
> >>> reliability of the omens, and to what extent is it "pattern / interpretation 
> / prediction" and to what 
> >>> extend "pattern / interpretation / belief / influence"?
> >> 
> >> I'm not sure what you mean by this. Could you maybe expand?
> > 
> > does low Axiom fortune telling perceive the future or does it harness symbols 
> > to help make a specific future come about? 
> 
> As with all other such issues, the answer is not found in the canon, and is a 
> matter of individual interpretation. Here is mine:
> 
> In Torg, there is such a thing as chance—random outcomes. There is also such a 
> thing as choice—people can choose to take certain actions. There is also such a 
> thing as Fate—some things are meant to be.

I agree with these. Chance, Choice, Fate. Is there a way of linking these to the axioms? 

Chance relies on the magic axiom. The higher the magic axiom, the more random events occur. (However, these are "divinable" using the magic axiom?)
Fate relies on the spiritual axiom, as it implies a higher power. (or is it a cosm-versal metaphysic?)
Choice occurs from the interaction of the living, and is non-axiomatic. (Or is it somehow linked to the social axiom?)

> Since there is no definite future for non-Fated 
> events, there is no way to exactly predict the future.

I don't think I agree with this entirely. But I'll come to this in relation to divination, below.

> fortune-telling cannot cause events, what it can do is affect the actions people take.

This is probably where I disagree with you. It strikes me that magic is about using symbols to create supernatural effects. Fortune telling uses symbols to create the supernatural effect of perceiving the future, but might not the act of fortune telling also be a symbol that influences the future? Is it a case of magical quantum uncertainty, such that where the future is dependent on chance, once divined that chance is no longer indeterminate?  Perhaps not always, not every time, and not equally at all axiom levels, but it's an intriguing twist on the uncertainty of divination!

I think this then reaches its apogee at Axiom 21 (or 33) when magic rules all, such that divination does entirely create the future, and thus fortune telling can at this time be 100% accurate? The reason I think this will occur is  because of the ubiquity of wish magic. It strikes me that the natural consequence of a population of wish parsers is that each will end up living in their own parallel universe, as that's the only way that each individual's wishes can remain consistent without being contradicted by everyone else's wishes - you can't all date Megan Fox, unless there is a Megan Fox for each of you! But then again, thinking too much of Maxi Axiom magic society is just going to make my head hurt....

Phil